Brake pad questions

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kustomizm
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Brake pad questions

Postby kustomizm » Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:55 pm

I am looking at a cheap way to improve my braking and thinking of Hawk pads. They make a HPS and a HP PLUS pad. Thinking the HPS would be way to go given the advice from Tire Rack. The HP PLUS is not street friendly I guess. I am looking for a stronger initial bite. Unsure if pads will gove that to me. Also this seems wasted since its the last race too. Any experience with Hawk pads or pad advice.
Derek R. #30 Silver 2011 Ford Mustang GT

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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby Trainable » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:32 pm

I wouldn't bother with HPS they're a decent pad, but they'll be marginally better than the stock pads on most sporty cars. HP+ from my experiences are fine for street. If it's cold out they might take a stop to get to temp and they're dusty, but if you're looking for a noticeable improvement in bite they're what you're looking for.

kustomizm
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby kustomizm » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:40 pm

Are they agressive on the rotors? Pad life? I dont mind dust. Do they squeal?
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby saabman » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:51 pm

I run HP Plus on the Sonett. Tons of braking even cold, and they dont fade when hot. No squeal.
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby Trainable » Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:26 am

kustomizm wrote:Are they agressive on the rotors? Pad life? I dont mind dust. Do they squeal?

Not aggressive. I'd guess ~40k would be the pad life for non track usage, but stuff like that is heavily dependent on the car. They might squeel when cold, but for these pads cold means winter temps and prior to the first stop. The only real downside of these in my experience is the dust, and I'd label these and ebc yellowstuffs as ideal auto-x pads.

kustomizm
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby kustomizm » Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:36 pm

Will it increase pedal resistance? Thanks for the feedback. They have a brake upgrade to the four piston front brembos. But are a little expensive. But pads may help greatly.
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby robinlsb » Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:36 pm

You may want to consider SS braided brake lines. And if you drive your car in the winter, I have found zero difference between the HP and HP+ pads.
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby Trainable » Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:24 pm

kustomizm wrote:Will it increase pedal resistance? Thanks for the feedback. They have a brake upgrade to the four piston front brembos. But are a little expensive. But pads may help greatly.

Nope, but better calipers might not either. I'd actually bet it might 'worsen' it, I know WRXes with 4/2 POT calipers have a softer pedal than ones with 1POTs all around. Proper pedal feel is the result of a good balance between boost and calipers in my experience. Changing out only one set on calipers or pads could also affect brake bias. All this said the improvement in initial bite should lessen the desire for a stiff pedal, a great deal of the negative associations we have with a soft pedal are related to the fact that it's often the result of spent fluid or air which result in unresponsive braking.

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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby kustomizm » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:17 pm

I dont think the fluid is roached yet. The car only has 25k miles on it. Its not that the pedal is soft in general just softer than my friends Evo with Brembos. I dont mind the pedal feel if I had a good bite that inspired confidence to brake late. I will try pads first and see given they are cheaper. If that doesnt do it and I decide to keep the car then the SVT Brembos may go on.
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MR Chuck
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby MR Chuck » Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:57 pm

Still wouldnt hurt to do a fluid change. I dont run mine more than 10k, bled once a year w/ good stuff.

Im running HPS and they're almost done. I'll be switching to either HP+ or something a bit more aggressive, dont feel the HPS was enough.
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby Apollyon12 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 5:42 pm

Speaking from experience, when you go with bigger brakes (larger chamber volume) you need a bigger master cylinder. With the bigger master cylinder, you need a bigger brake booster to help "push" or you need to push harder. I am probably going to go back to the OEM size front calipers on my car primarily because I can easily source the HP+ pads for them (only Porterfield makes pads for my current calipers) and because it's alot easier to change the calipers than try to shoe-horn a bigger brake booster onto my firewall.

"Feel" can be improved with stainless lines, but racing blue fluid and a fresh bleed will go a long way. *** Stainless lines can change your class I.E. stock class post '92 *** When you change the lines, you have to rebleed, so is the improvement the SS lines or having no air in the system. That you have only 25k on the car doesn't really matter when you consider the use you put it to.
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby Rocwandrer » Thu Oct 10, 2013 7:19 pm

kustomizm wrote:I am looking at a cheap way to improve my braking and thinking of Hawk pads. They make a HPS and a HP PLUS pad. Thinking the HPS would be way to go given the advice from Tire Rack. The HP PLUS is not street friendly I guess. I am looking for a stronger initial bite. Unsure if pads will gove that to me. Also this seems wasted since its the last race too. Any experience with Hawk pads or pad advice.



FWIW, initial bite in a functional oem system is most dramatically impacted by pads. stiffer lines will decrease the travel for the same force, more so the older your car is. Fresh fluid (if the old stuff is relatively new) will decrease the change in feel with increasing brake temperature. Mustangs are known for pretty crappy brakes stock. When I went from the excellent stock pads on my car to ebc greenstuffs (only for light cars, the heavy car version of the greenstuff compound is junk), the only change was slightly sooner progressive initial grab.

All that said, change the fluid first. Seriously. Baseline with fresh fluid, even on a new-ish car with low miles. Tons of stainless lines, magic pads, caliper upgrades, etc, are sold by word of mouth on how huge the improvement was when most of the improvement was actually fresh fluid.

kustomizm
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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby kustomizm » Fri Oct 11, 2013 8:47 am

What fluid would you recommend for the car. Stoptech has a STR-600. Dot4. Which has a higher boiling point and is DOT 4 compatible. This is also a hydrualic clutch system too.
Derek R. #30 Silver 2011 Ford Mustang GT

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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby Trainable » Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:56 pm

ATE superblue and the equivalent non-colored version are solid. Depending on who you ask you can use the difference in color to do a simple full flush of the system.

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Re: Brake pad questions

Postby robinlsb » Fri Oct 11, 2013 3:28 pm

ATE super blue is now (August , 2013)illegal, so it might be hard to find it :(
Robin


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